Raising Financially Fit Kids

49 comments

by Scott Pape - October 7th 2011

financially fit kids literacyThis week I had the strangest experience.

I was on my way to a lunch meeting with a senior banker when he called and asked whether I’d mind if his teenage daughter joined us. He mumbled something about it being school holidays and then added, “besides I want her to learn something from you”.

It turned out that I learned from her. When they arrived I quickly realised that while his daughter may have been sweet sixteen she looked twenty-six – all made up and with a perfectly rehearsed pout.

And not less than 10 minutes after she sat down (and began, or actually continued, texting on her phone) she interrupted our conversation:

Sweet Sixteen: “Daddy, I’m bored!”

Daddy: “Go for a walk to the shops then.”

Sweet Sixteen: (extending her hand): “Give me money and I will.”

Daddy (pulls out his wallet): “Umm.”

Sweet Sixteen (snatches a $50 note): “I’ll be back in 45 minutes.”

Daddy: “No, you’ll be back for more when the money runs out!”

I was gobsmacked – I thought these conversations only happened on Modern Family. In any event he was right – she came back inside 45 minutes, grabbed more money, and was off again. Her old man was nothing more than her personal parental piggy bank.

Now I have no experience raising a teenager, but as I left the meeting I couldn’t help wondering what her dad was teaching her about money, and where her behaviour would take her in the future.

This week Westpac published a survey on the topic of kids and money, called ‘Creating Brighter Financial Futures for Victorian Children’. The survey asked some tough questions of parents. And the answers underscore why I have such a tough time when I go into the teenage trenches (the classroom) to try and teach students about money.

Money for nothing?

The survey asked how much pocket money parents thought children should get. Some said $10, some said $20, some said more.

I say zero. They’re already well ahead getting free bills and board.

A parent’s job is to prepare their children for the real world, and in the real world, if you don’t work you don’t get paid.

For primary school kids, who can’t work in a coalmine (yet), household chores are the way to go. For older kids, Woolworths is the answer.

Ever since I was knee-high to a grasshopper I’ve worked, whether it was a paper round or following my dad around a country town helping him with his work (and being paid by the odd single share in BHP, thank you very much).

Eventually I reached the hallowed age of 14 and 9 months. That very day I walked into Woolworths (the pokies people), and got a job as the only male in the delicatessen. Picture this: I wore a white short-sleeved butcher’s jacket, a red bow-tie and a paper sailor’s hat. I looked like a corporate version of the Village People.

I was an awkward, pimple-faced part-time worker, slicing cold cuts for the minimum wage. But that job taught me the difference between salami and sausages (actually, not as much as you’d think), and that money had real value: eight bucks in my wallet equaled one hour of work.

Three little pigs

Over half the survey respondents (57.8%) reported that their children use a money box, although two-thirds (71.1%) thought their children should be able to spend their pocket money on whatever they want.

My take is that parents need to understand that an allowance isn’t spending money – it’s a tool for financial education.

Primary school kids should be paid to do extra chores around the house – usually a couple of bucks a job. Then they can put their ‘pay’ into three separate jam jars or piggy banks (it doesn’t really matter what containers you use so long as they’re see-through – kids learn by being able to see the money building up in the jar).

Why three separate containers?

One is for spending – kids need to learn how to become savvy shoppers, and the best way to teach them is through experience.

Young people always want everything right now, so the second container is for savings. Teaching them that they need to save for stuff is the cornerstone of an effective financial education, and pays lifelong dividends.

The final container should be marked giving. Done well, this is a life lesson in contentment – after all, the happiest people on the planet are those who give. It also teaches children that by living in Australia they’re already among the richest people on the planet, and it puts money in its proper perspective.

For teenagers flipping burgers, the same applies. They’ll have outgrown the piggy banks, so they can put their earnings into three separate bank accounts (spending, saving, giving) instead.

All of which is pretty commonsense stuff − work hard, spend wisely, save money, and give some of it away. But you’d be amazed at the number of 30-year-olds I meet who still haven’t worked it out – and many of them are parents themselves.

Money talks

The survey found that only about half of the respondents (52.5%) felt very comfortable have the ‘money conversation’ with their children.
That’s probably why there’s almost universal agreement that teenagers need to be taught about money while they’re in school. And as someone involved in financial literacy training, I can assure you it can be a life-changing experience for some students – but generally only for those kids whose parents have already laid the groundwork long ago.

Think back to your childhood. Your ideas on how to handle money – rightly or wrongly – were probably set by watching your parents. Did they fight about it, or were they in control? Maybe they were frugal, or hard workers who spent more time at work than at home.

Or maybe, like Sweet Sixteen, you trained your parents that it was easier to open their wallet than spend time teaching you the value of money.

Either way, it’s likely that it has had a fairly direct correlation to how much money you have in the bank today – and how much you enjoy it and, ultimately, how much you appreciate it.

Tread Your Own Path!

The Three Little Piggy Banks

Bank 1:

For Spending – learn to become a savvy shopper

Bank 2:

For Saving – learn to save for things over time

Bank 3:

For Giving – show your kids how fortunate they are



Photo: http://www.flickr.com/photos/vincealongi/299066758/

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Barefoot also recommends:

  1. “You’ve Got to Buy a Home Before You Have Kids”
  2. How To Get Financially Fit
  3. Why Adult Children Have to Grow Up and Get Out!
  4. Start Saving Now for Your Child’s Higher Education

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49 comments

kj October 7, 2011 at 10:02 am

Scott. Absolutely brilliant thinking.. Ill be implementing that with my kids, and I love the fact that you have pointed out a giving money box. I think by giving, it teaches us that we are better off than others in the community, and that is often thanks to our parents, and luck, rather than birthright.

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Kelly October 7, 2011 at 11:10 am

Yes, visual representations are great, especially in the world of iphones, laptops etc.

I also think that you should make your kids spend their dough in cash – so when they by a playstation for $300 or whatever, they have to hand over the cash and feel the cost and loss, rather than just swiping their plastic EFTPOS card.

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Andrew October 7, 2011 at 10:07 am

Can someone explain why we teach kids about calculus and not about how money works?

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Andrew October 7, 2011 at 10:09 am

Or why we don’t review what we’ve typed before we hit submit?

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Barefoot Ben October 7, 2011 at 10:14 am

No probs Andrew, we’ll fix it up for you

Barefoot Ben

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Sherree October 19, 2011 at 8:03 am

Andrew, thankfully kids will be learning about how money works. There are many resources now out there linked to school curriculum. ASIC have funded a project for resources and teacher education in this area to be integrated into the Australian Curriculum. Google the Consumer and Financial Literacy Framework to see what is intended.
Regards,
Sherree

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Peter October 7, 2011 at 10:14 am

Well…..Nice in theory Scott but there are realities of raising a child that would sink your black and white approach. Sure encourage them to get a job, encourage them to save, assign chores to compensate for pocket money. But there will always be times when a parent has to, or wants to, step in to support their offspring. Even when they eventually get their own home, you can bet they will be back for help. And that is OK because family is about helping each other. As far as launching a child into the world with a good understanding of money, you may tread your own path, but that path is a fine line and it’s easy to stray.

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SBM October 7, 2011 at 10:31 am

Scott,
Im amazed that 1 guy has so much sense! keep up the good work. Working in a bank its been something that really gets to me, when we have school kids that come in (predominantly the high school kids) and have no clue on managing money, soon their account is at zero, and there is nothing that i can do to stop them withdrawing their money and wasting it. I wish there was a financial advice class at schools.

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Michael October 7, 2011 at 10:33 am

Scott About the financial education at school…. I had a financial studies class in high school. Our teacher was old and didn’t understand compound interest and taught us that any financial transaction online was dangerous and should be avoided so we practiced writing out checks instead. That was in 2002 when I was in year 10. It’s a good idea in theory but I wouldn’t trust our education system with educating our youth on money matters. It’s too important to be left to chance

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Maxi October 7, 2011 at 10:47 am

I know grown adults who are still asking for weekly handouts from their parents.

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Kate October 7, 2011 at 1:35 pm

Maxi, I agree, except the grown adult is my father asking me for handouts! wtf.

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SBM October 7, 2011 at 11:00 am

I agree that the educational system is not the ideal, but the fact that schools is the easiest way to reach the young audience I see the benefit in a financial managment class. I also see the benefit in a financial advisor in high schools, where it is mandatory for students to meet and talk.

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Kelly October 7, 2011 at 11:07 am

I agree that financial education in schools is a must, but not by financial advisors – kids need simple, basic advice about the habits around money, not specific product advice, most of it tainted through conflicts of interest etc.

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SBM October 7, 2011 at 11:01 am

and whats the alternative?

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H October 7, 2011 at 10:43 am

But what do the savings become for a child? My 9 yo stepson gets money put into his bank every f/n plus spending money for the jobs he does around the house. Only problem is I have no idea to tell him what to do with the money in the account? Toys? Car when he’s old enough?
Worse yet, he withdrew all the money he had when he was with his mother and spent it on some crappy game… Nice one.

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Kelly October 7, 2011 at 10:46 am

So true!

What are everyone’s thoughts around the actual age period where kids really sculpt their habits around money (primary age, or teenage) ?

Would be interested to know everyone’s thoughts on this.

Kelly

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leah October 7, 2011 at 11:09 am

great advice….wish i’d been taught even remotely like this when I was a child….did the work, didn’t get the training about how to employ my money.

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Matt October 7, 2011 at 11:27 am

Great story Scott.

Money is an extremely emotive topic. I agree that it has a lot to do with how you were brought up but I think additionally how you spend/save money has a lot to do with your personality, self esteem and how you see yourself as well.

I see these decisions like a game of poker. The discretionary items you purchase (house, car, clothes, credit card balances) are what everyone can see, they are the bets that you place but they are not worth anything – ie the “show”. On the other side, the things you own (cash, savings, shares) are your cards, they hold the “value” and decide whether you win or lose.

Too many people want to make a big bet, look great. But they aren’t interested in actually having a few good cards in their hand to back it up.

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Simon October 7, 2011 at 11:40 am

Hi Barefoot, I have seen “piggy banks” on TV that have separate compartments in them called spend, save, donate, etc….. Do you know where they can be purchased? Or have you thought about selling your own foot shapped piggy bank?

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Ellen October 7, 2011 at 1:16 pm

We have the educational money box for our kids and it’s worked brilliantly. It has 4 compartments; giving, living, saving and wealthing. A screwdriver is needed to open the last two compartments.

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Monique October 7, 2011 at 11:52 am

Great message!
Our daughter isnt yet 2 years old and already has a few hundred dollars in the bank. We didn’t open a kids account (the interest rates are crap) instead I’ve opened a high interest saver for me and a seperate one for her, 6.5% thanks very much. We hope this will eventually pay for her education or a deposit on her 1st home. She also has a piggy bank at home and we give her a few coins and say ‘put it in your bank’ and she knows what to do. We want her to have the head start that we never did.

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Peta October 7, 2011 at 11:58 am

I have 4 kids and they have 3 jars per child – alot of jars taking up space!!! Someone point me in the direction of the piggy banks mentioned in a previous post.

Our 14 year old has just secured his 2nd job in a local store using a fantastic reference from the pamphlet distribution company he worked for over the school holidays… I may be old fashioned, but I believe all kids should get some kind of ‘job’ when they hit 1213/14, be it baby sitting, pamphlet delivery or working at Macca’s.

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rosemary October 7, 2011 at 12:22 pm

Great idea Scott
We follow the $1 day principle and put $1 day in separate bank accounts for us and the kids. They also contribute 1/3rd of their pocket money a fortnight into the account. As soon as it reaches $1000 we invest the money into shares. The kids will have a nice little nest egg waiting for them when they get older. More importantly they love to see the money grow (slowly at first) and help choose the shares. The kids also have a kiva account each that they enjoy watching the money being paid back and then reinvesting with a new person or family.

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Steve H October 7, 2011 at 12:34 pm

Um Scott,

I started out in Woolies in a country town as well at the age of 14 yrs and 9 months. Have we worked together ????

I was running the Produce Department every Saturday and generally school holidays from the age of 16 to 18 and on top of that stayed back and helped with the nightfill.

I am often asked how you are able to save a substantial sum of your salary and I say it’s Woolies TAFE.

My teenage kids will be getting a Woolie or Coles education as well.

All the better employees in our organisation have worked in retail.

Great column…

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Dee October 7, 2011 at 12:40 pm

Maybe each high school kid should be given a copy of your book??? I know my kids will be getting a copy when they are old enough… We often teach our kids the basics – even in food shopping – you take a basic list and you find the best value. You plan ahead for your money and what you would like to do with it. I have always made my kids save their pocket money and allow them a certain amount for spending. Hadn’t quite thought of the giving money box! That’s a great idea! Also like the see through money box idea! Would work for my kids! Thanks Scott!

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Marguerite October 7, 2011 at 1:33 pm

Thank you!!! We were starting to think we were out of touch. We teach our children the above principals (not always easy and with some resitance from them) and are starting to see the fruit of our labour. They don’t just buy something, they want value for money. My 12 year old negotiated a 10% discount at Toysrus for a damaged box :)

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Tiffany October 7, 2011 at 2:09 pm

Hi, Thanks for this article, I will be posting it for some of my friends to read. I am pleased you have confirmed what we already do with our kids.

Still you got $8 p/h LOL I must be older I was only getting $5 p/h at Bid W back in the day and it was still cash not bank deposit. Thanks again.

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Cameron October 7, 2011 at 2:23 pm

I love this post Scott and I love that you continue to advocate for giving, its so important.

Shame though that some good planning in this regard is ruined by a Federal Government giving CentreLink money to teenagers for very little reason. I see it time and again that teenagers change when they are given free money.

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GS October 7, 2011 at 5:40 pm

So true! Any teenager I have known will take the easy option if it is on offer. Centerlink robs them of their potential & desire. So very sad.

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Gail October 7, 2011 at 2:29 pm

Amen! I’ve been saying this to my kids forever & they too have worked since 14 years, 9 months. It builds skills & confidence. Bike drug run for the Chemist, Fish & Chip Shop, baby sitting,Woolies also …. At each job they always have their eyes open & learning what they are good at & not, also what they like & not. Self-awareness!

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GS October 7, 2011 at 2:39 pm

14 years & 9 months we typed up resumes, pretty basic stuff, drove to town & walked in & out of every place we though would hire. (Mum, sat outside, kids petrified) Cold calling. EVERY time they got a few job offers. BUT … parents must give up school holidays, Christmas breaks & do the drop off & pick up for years & not many will do the hard yards. Kids now, tertiary educated, worked through uni, (retail, clubs, sink pigs etc.) now working in their fields & productive, happy members of the community. And, don’t mind getting their hands dirty!

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Nathan Gunn October 7, 2011 at 4:05 pm

Great stuff Scott,

I wish I had been taught about money when I was younger, I had to wait until my 20s and a mountain of debt before I got the valuable lessons I needed.

The biggest problem is that it’s often the Blind leading the Blind and sometimes teaching kids about money at secondary school is already at a point where kids have to unlearn bad habits.

The most unfortunate thing for this sweet sixteen is that her life is well mapped out, a read of The Millionaire Next Door allows one to map her life out with good accuracy.

I’ve gone down the path of buying nieces and nephews investments and then I print out little certificates for them to get a hand on. Then I go later with them and show them what’s happening with them.

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Jane October 7, 2011 at 6:53 pm

Most of your money habits are learned by observing parents. If you see them struggle then you hoard, if they are spendaholics that seem to have a bottomless credit cards, you will probably have the same traits.

You either copy your parents, or if you saw it as bad, go in the opposite, but your money habits are almost universally formed without either you or your parent being aware of it, simply by watching from the moment you were old enough to talk.

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Glen October 7, 2011 at 7:38 pm

G’day Barefoot,
My son (grade one) = $1 per week pocket money was told at school to bring a gold coin for the Haiti Earthquake appeal, he went to his own pocket money and got a dollar coin and told us that he was going to give it to appeal, we told him that we would give him the money, he was adamant, so both Mum & I matched it (we didn’t want to upstage the rest of the kids as these special days really show which kids are the “haves ” & the “have not’s” We were blown away. Just thought that I would share it with you.

Cheers
Glen

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Mel October 8, 2011 at 6:23 am

Scott, I love your approach and live Barefoot. I love the idea of separate piggy banks and letting kids create their own mojo.

My only dilemma with this is the ‘working for pocket money’ idea – and that’s because in my house, housework is non-negotiable. It’s part of contributing to the family and the household. Children are spoilt and have so many things already, so much technology, so many toys. They really don’t care about washing the car for 5 bucks. Or feeding the cat each night for $1. My children are just as likely to look at me and say ‘thanks Mum, I’ll pass’ at the offer of money. And then you’re at this hard place.

So in our house, I give the kids $10 pocket money a week (they are still in primary school) and they have to do all of their chores regardless. I will let them learn the hard lessons of paid employment in the real world. For now I’ll just teach them about saving and spending and giving :) Little steps.

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Karen October 11, 2011 at 12:00 pm

Mel, when I was a kids, we had the same rules; chores were non-negotiable, pocket-money was constant. Once, my brother refused to mow the lawn – one of his normal jobs – so I did it. Mum paid me $5, out of his pocket money. Needless to say, it never happened again!! Mind you, pocket money stopped after we got part time jobs, but the chores didn’t.

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Sally October 8, 2011 at 11:50 am

What age do you think is a good time to start this?

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Mike (teacher) October 8, 2011 at 4:24 pm

I’m a High school teacher (for pocket money) and an investor and small time property developer.
I would love to teach kids at school about saving, managing money, investing in shares, funds and property investment strategies.
I have approached principals in the past, however, they were reluctant to let me teach for fear of being sued! (Giving financial advice – in case they lost money etc)
My wife and I have accumulated 7 properties in under 4 years, and that is my passion.
I am planning to write a book titled “How to get rich – on a teachers salary”!

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Mary October 10, 2011 at 8:02 pm

Hey Mike (teacher),

Can you teach me how to get 7 properties in 4 years?

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Eve October 9, 2011 at 10:28 am

How about a 4th jar – Investment?
I talk to my kids about the 4 pillars:
1. Spending – cash on hand for the little things
2. Saving – toward defined goals
3. Investment – for long-term growth, never to be spent
4. Charity (although I like the sound of Kiva loans rather than donations)
I’ve been getting teen financial literacy books out of library, and while some of them mention investment briefly, none of them put it up there as a major pillar of your financial stability (I have our header water tank in mind when I think of this). The investment jar looks to the long term. When it comes down to it, the other three jars are still just about spending … the water will keep pouring out if the tank isn’t evenly supported on four posts.

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Nathan Gunn October 10, 2011 at 10:21 am

I would go so far as to say that whilst spending and investment are not the same they are both subsets of saving. One can save to invest and also save to spend. This is looking at it in it’s most simple form as you could argue it even further than that about how they are essentially interlinked.

It’s the next stage that becomes a little more difficult with children, teaching them about how money flows around financial statements. This proves a challenge for most people as it’s not a widely well educated area.

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Simon October 9, 2011 at 6:25 pm

Good advice. I did chores but that was expected and I was never paid. However I was lucky my parents had businesses. I worked in the green grocers and a market garden from the age of 9. I saved most of my money myself , going back to the time I filled 2 piggy banks by begging in the street, until to my mothers embarrassment she found she raised a 6 years old sheister.

I dealt with lawyers and accountants as my parents had limited English. This gave me a sense of getting things done and dealing with people at a young age.

Which meant I had $20,000 to go to university, buy a cheapish car. And avoid debt starting my career. And my parents then were rewarded by me being financially independent.

And although I didn’t go into my parents businesses I have a great career doing something I enjoy.

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mark October 10, 2011 at 10:52 am

Great message scott.

My plan is to save $1,000 a year for my daughter (currently 5months old), so when she hits 18 or 21 i can give her a deposit for a house/or uni. I know that kind of beats the purpose of your post, but i work 5 days a week, pay all my bills and still really needed a helping hand from my parents when i bought my first unit. So you do need some financial help, but I’d take help from my family rather than the banks any day. Loved the part of giving, we really do forget how lucky we are here in Australia.

As far as allowing the education system to teach our kids about saving, would we really want a government department teaching our kids, with Swanny as an example of how to manage your money! (How much do we owe now? $40+ billlion?! ;)

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matt October 11, 2011 at 8:22 am

no.. that’s just how much we’ve lost in a year. we owe 150 to 200bln I think :D

but still that is only half of what the government earns in one year… so compared to most first home buyers, who probably start out with a debt of about 5 times their annual earnings, the government is looking pretty responsible :p

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Nathan Gunn October 11, 2011 at 9:35 am

Don’t forget that Swannie wants to take from the Future Fund, that means taking from an asset and leaving a gap for an unfunded liability.

If you consider what some US states have done like California, this proposition becomes scary.

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Julie Said October 11, 2011 at 5:29 am

Great post, thanks once again
My daughter always spent more on clothes and fun than she could afford,
and at 22 is now starting to save for holidays etc. (she does own her car though!, and is off to Cambodia soon to work at an orphanage in part of her uni break!..proud mum), Julie

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matt October 11, 2011 at 8:11 am

“Young people always want everything right now”

so, by ‘young’ you mean ‘under 70′ ?

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Brian October 21, 2011 at 6:47 am

What about an extra jar labelled ‘For Taxes’? They may as well learn about taxation as well. This money can go towards government (family) purchases.

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